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  • Acura RSX Type-S

    Hi all,

    New to the forum and was hoping someone might be able to point me in the right direction. I have a 2006 Acura RSX Type-S that I have been doing track days in over the past few summers. Prior to that I did the same as well as autocross in a Mini Cooper S. Anyway, I have been doing some modifications to the car during this time and was thinking that next year (2017) I may do some wheel to wheel in it. Eventually I would like to get into vintage but I thought since I already have a car this would be a good place to start.

    The question is where would the car be classed? As of now I've dones suspension/swaybars and an LSD and some other small add ons including seats. Planning to do a cage over the winter.

    I suspect that it would go into ITR or ITS or perhaps t4. I've read through the SCCA GCR but having some trouble making some sense of it. Any assistance or advice would be appreciated.

  • #2
    I typically find the IT portion of the GCR pretty easy to follow ... except when they do the completely stupid thing they did to your car (ask me how I really feel). There are a few cars out there they have done this to as well. They dual classed it. You can actually run either ITR or ITS. It is basically letting you have the option of a) spending a ton of money to get down to weight or b) driving around with a bunch of free weights in your car. While neither of these are ideal, it is pretty easy to just not spend the money and be a little overweight for ITR. I find the idea of "just weight" added to any race car absurd and dangerous. ITR would be my suggestion.

    Your options with MC are ITR, ST2, EP, SP, or GT3. I think the decision really comes down to ITR or ST2. ITR is more restrictive in what you can do, good it you prefer driving over tinkering, plus it helps the budget. ST2 is more open for people who like to modify their car heavily and not follow a rule set. All mods you said so far are good for either, so it's your choice. A car legal for ITR will be legal for ST2 as well, so you could make the decision even after you start coming out. I started out in the IT classes and it fit well. Now I like to tinker more so prefer ST2.

    Do you have a shop to do the cage for you? Or are you looking for one?
    Last edited by Integra111; 12-08-2015, 07:24 PM. Reason: typo
    Jared Cromas
    SCSCC Race Steward
    #111 ST2 Red 2000 Honda S2000
    #111 FP Gold/Blk 1990 Acura Integra

    Comment


    • #3
      Hello and welcome!
      Do you belong to a Midwestern Council Club?
      I would suggest doing this right away.
      Where do you live?
      The clubs are set up in different regions in different areas of Wisconsin and Illinois.
      Meet and greet some people in your area at the club's monthly meeting and speak with someone that races W2W in your area.
      Here is the link to the rules for the organization and it gives all the info you seek.
      http://mcscc.org/files/MC%202015%20G...%205-18-15.pdf

      This can also be accessed from the Midwestern Council home page at any time from the left side of the page under "General Competition Rules"

      My club NSSCC (as others) has a new member mentor program that will help you find out what you need to do to go racing. Being a part of a club early in the year will allow you to get the necessary steps taken to get the car up to snuff and get you ready for Drivers School with Midwestern Council.

      Having some contacts in a club that you can call on for help through the process will pay big dividends in helping you make the proper choices with the car etc.

      Good luck... don't be afraid to ask for support.
      Lots of people in MC are great at helping you make it all happen.
      Jason Ostrowski
      Friendly Ghost Racing
      1969 Triumph GT6

      Comment


      • #4
        I was reading through the GCR again last night and you're right, it doesn't seem as bad as i initially thought. It seems what one can do is clearly spelled out. I also read on another forum about the dual classing of my car due to a protest and I agree I think ITR is probably the place for my car. I didn't know about the ST classes...I will have to read up on those. I have been working with a friend to do the cage. He is a mechanic by trade and does a lot of track cars.

        Comment


        • #5
          GT6 Jason,

          Thanks for the welcome. I am a member of the Madison Club but I live in Milwaukee. I just haven't done any Midwest Council events with the exception of a few years ago. Doesn't really count though as my car at the time (Mini) died on the way into Blackhawk on a rainy Memorial Day. That is a whole other story though.

          I heard about the seminar in March that talks about getting into W2W and I am planning to attend that if I can. I've attended the drivers school in the past but just a spectator.

          By the way the GT6 is one of my favorite Triumphs. Really a great looking car.

          Thanks again everyone for offering up advice. Probably looking at 2017 as my first year but I like to be prepared and this will help spread out the cost.

          Comment


          • #6
            One follow up question? My car has a mechanical sunroof. I was thinking of taking it out but the rules read as if that would be illegal. Can anyone confirm if I need to retain the sunroof and its motor? The reason I ask now is that the cage I am going to order can be ordered for a sunroof or non sunroof model.

            Manual and electric sun roofs, original or aftermarket,
            where the panel is not normally removable shall be re
            tained and run in the closed position.
            Note
            :
            Convertible model cars are
            only permitted if they were only available as convertibles (e.g., MG Midget.) Components (motors, cables, rails) may be
            removed provided the panel is securely retained. Removable sunro
            of, hardtops or T
            -
            tops panels may be retained if bolted in or
            removed completely

            Comment


            • #7
              Interesting question. When I was building my car back in 2004, the rule allowed the sunroof to be removed so long as the replacement panel was of the same material as the roof. In other words, no using fiberglass or aluminum to save weight of a steel bodied car.

              Since I am not currently building an IT car with a sunroof, I didn't realize that that portion of the rule appears to have been removed. I found a few exerts on the web of the old rule that used to be at the end of the rule section you are looking at.

              "Removable sunroof or T-top may be retained if bolted or welded in, or removed completely. Glass sunroofs must be removed. All sunroofs may be replaced with panel or replacement skin of the same material as the original surrounding roof material"

              So, apparently, the way I read the current rules, yes, it is illegal to remove your sunroof for IT.

              That being said, I say do it anyway. Especially if the sunroof is glass, I would not want a heavy piece glass sitting over my head while racing, end of story (if it is all steel, then no big deal). Plus, it gives you extra headroom, which even if you don't technically need, is always safer with more gap between you and what could potentially hit you. As long as you match meta types (i.e. close to the same weight), I highly doubt anyone would ever challenge you. I don't know when the rule changed, but I was running IT as late as 2012 and non one ever said anything to me.

              Assuming the cage kits are the same cost, just get the non-sunroof one and you can trim it to fit. In my build (back in 2004) I bought the sunroof kit one and just added risers to the car body.
              Jared Cromas
              SCSCC Race Steward
              #111 ST2 Red 2000 Honda S2000
              #111 FP Gold/Blk 1990 Acura Integra

              Comment


              • #8
                It appears that MC only slightly adapted the SCCA verbiage.

                MC: Convertible tops and attaching hardware shall be completely removed. Manual and electric sun roofs, original or aftermarket, where the panel is not normally removable shall be retained and run in the closed position.
                Note: Convertible model cars are only permitted if they were only available as convertibles (e.g., MG Midget.) Components (motors, cables, rails) may be removed provided the panel is securely retained. Removable sunroof, hardtops or T-tops panels may be retained if bolted in or removed completely.


                Interpretation - nothing addresses material: original glass, metal, or plastic panels must be retained. While questionable and it seems in reference to convertible components only, I believe the notation to components being removed could apply to the sunroof as well as the convertible.

                SCCA: Convertible tops and attaching hardware shall be completely
                removed. Note: Convertible model cars are permitted if they
                were only available as convertibles (e.g. MG Midget), or if
                the convertible model is specifically allowed on the vehicle
                spec line. Convertible models may compete with their respective
                OEM hardtop. All latches shall be replaced with positive
                fasteners. Manual and electric sunroofs, original or aftermarket,
                where the panel is not normally removable shall be
                retained and run in the closed position. Components (motors,
                cables, rails) may be removed provided the panel is securely
                retained. Removable sunroof or T-top may be retained if bolted
                or welded in, or removed completely. Glass sunroofs must be
                removed. All sunroofs may be replaced with panel or replacement
                skin of the same material as the original surrounding roof
                material.


                Interpretation: Original non-removable panels must be used (actual panel with skin). Components may be removed with positive retention of panel. Glass must be removed and replaced with a faux skin that is of the same material as the rest of the roof.

                I'd say build to the current SCCA rule and I'll submit a rules change request to the IT chair to update to the current SCCA verbiage.

                Welcome to MC and hopefully IT. Feel free to ask any other questions as they come up!
                Tim Schreyer
                #38 ITS BMW 325is

                Comment


                • #9
                  Help is what MC is About

                  I think you said that you were a member of MSCC and live in the Milwaukee area, you could contact one of the MKE clubs for help. We at LSCC go and look at cars for new drivers B4 they would go to a DS so if some thing needs to be fixed, you do not find out at Tech the day B4 the DS. So you are doing the right thing now build it right the first time with help here. Good Luck Ron J

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Wow thanks guys for all the help! I really appreciate it and it is confirming my decision to run with MCSCC.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Just got back from the PRI trade show and read your post. When I built my ITA car I went by the SCCA rules for IT and not MC's rules. If someone wants to protest my lack of sunroof then let them but I don't think anyone cares. I used SCCA rules so that if I ever want to sell it, it's an easier sell to anyone and not just to a MC member.

                      The rule difference is more likely due to no one who races in IT comparing the two sets of rules to "fix" these types of problems.

                      Jared used to be good at doing this but since he doesn't race in IT anymore why should he bother. I keep saying to myself that I need to do this and perhaps I may this winter.
                      First Race Car - ITC 1980 Ford Fiesta #80 MCSCC Champ 1989 & 1994
                      Second Race Car - ASR 1993 Ford Mustang Cobra "R" #58
                      Current Race Car - ITA 1988 VW 16V Scirocco #80

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Hey pdoharatosa- first off, welcome and I hope to see you at the track!! MCSCC is a great place to race.

                        As for your question about your glass sunroof, you will really want to remove that and put a steel panel in its place. Some people weld a sheet metal panel in or just rivet a panel in place like I did on my ITA Integra.

                        I do try to keep MCSCC's IT rules parallel to SCCA's but this one is a little off. I will get a proposal to the board for their next meeting to get this cleaned up.

                        If you have some time to kill, check this RSX IT build out for some neat build ideas..

                        http://honda-tech.com/appearance-bui...build-2983117/

                        Feel free to hit me up with any other questions you may have on the car and would love to see some pics of the car.

                        Devin Anderson
                        IT/SS Committee Chairperson

                        Comment


                        • #13
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                          • #14
                            How's the build coming? Will we be seeing you out this year?
                            Tim Schreyer
                            #38 ITS BMW 325is

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Hey there sorry for not responding sooner. It's coming along. Cage is in and now I realize I really need a Hans. I was planning to go to the Driver school last weekend to watch but had other commitments. I need to look at the calendar to see when the next event is. Maybe I could volunteer...12961580_1586155938367258_1832917282007701468_n.jpg

                              12928341_1584454255204093_356706941824805623_n(1).jpg

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